Corn Snake Substrate

Discussion in 'Enclosures, Heating & Lighting' started by ~Eris~, Jul 4, 2004.

  1. ~Eris~

    ~Eris~ Embryo

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    Here's the first of a million questions I'm going to have about the corn snake I am planning on getting. I was wondering if there are reasons for not using potting soil as a substrate. I would love to be able to set up a really natural looking enclosure for my snake, similar to the ones my toads are living in - potting soil, lots of live plants, wood, rocks, and a sunken 'pond' (nesting stainless steel pet dishes). I would silicone rocks to make caves for him, similar to what I've done for fish. I realise I could do a similar setup using repti bark or some such thing, but I was wondering what the cons are on using soil.
     
  2. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  3. stormyva

    stormyva Well-Known Member

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    Soil is going to absorb more of the mess from a snake and would therefore be harder to keep clean. The safest thing for a cage is for it to be simple and easy to clean. The live plants and rocks are fine, but also can get hard to clean and when the snake gets bigger it will destroy the plants.
     
  4. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  5. Axe

    Axe Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, like Stormy says, it's difficult (but not impossible) to clean properly.

    Corns love to burrow (just putting them on aspen proves this), and often they will poop under the surface of the substrate. This means that you won't see it, and it could be festering under there for several weeks until you do a complete substrate change.

    If you want a semi-naturalistic substrate that you could probably afford to completely switch out and replace every couple of weeks, you might want to look at a mixture of top soil (not potting soil - that's the one with all the white bits like perlite in it) and cypress mulch.

    I know many who use just cypress mulch as a substrate for all kinds of snakes (corns, boas, cobras, rattlers) with no ill effects. Although, depending where you are in the country, you'll want to be careful about who and where you buy your mulch from. Some locations are notorious for picking up mites in cypress mulch.
     
  6. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  7. Sirch

    Sirch Member

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    and what places would that be
    also, a side note, does stormyva stand for stormy virginia?
     
  8. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  9. Axe

    Axe Well-Known Member

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    Well, just various places around the country that are prone to here.

    Home Depot here in FL has great cypress mulch. Home Depot in other areas of the country don't. It depends on where the mulch originated, how it's been stored, and if it's been treated (and you do not want mulch that's been treated with anti-parisitics).
     
  10. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  11. ~Eris~

    ~Eris~ Embryo

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    Thanks for the answers. :D I knew there had to be reasons people don't tend to use soil as a substrate, but I wanted to know what they were. (can't just tell me not to do something - gotta tell me why not to do it, or I'm twice as likely to try it out! lol)

    stormyva - When you say the snake will destroy the plants when he gets older, do you mean from crushing them and burrowing around their roots, or is there some other plant-destroying behaviour I'm not considering?

    Axe - I've always referred to any blend of screened top soil + anything else as potting soil, even without little white bits in it. B) My normal blend for working with houseplants is a mix of top soil, well composted bark mulch, peat moss, and sand. Is there an issue with keeping reptiles on a substrate containing peat moss? I'm not ignoring your advice to avoid the soil substrate, I'm just curious if it's an issue, seeing as it's quite the debate when it comes to amphibians.
     
  12. Axe

    Axe Well-Known Member

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    Hey, asking "why?" is what's important, especially when it comes to live animals, you did the right thing. B)

    I don't think there should be an issue using peat moss/sphagnum moss. I've been using it with various Florida residents (ringnecks, corn snakes and other rat snakes), and in humid hides for leopard geckos & viper geckos with no problems :D
     
  13. stormyva

    stormyva Well-Known Member

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    Yes the stormyva is stormy + virginia. It was a name that got made up several years ago when I first started chatting on line using ICQ and YIM :)

    One thing that is great about the herp hobby..... there can sometimes be a dozen ways to succeed in meeting the same goal. In this case the goal being providing a safe, clean home with the proper temperatures and humidity levels. :)
    Any of the substrates discussed above would be fine. Some will be more work to keep clean than others. What you use all depends on the look that you are after and how much work you are willing to put in to the cage. I have 16 snakes right now so there is not enough time in the day to be changing out a dirt substrate every time the snakes makes a mess in the cage. Sometimes what works in one cage for one snake may not work for another. That is why I have some cages with paper towels, some newspaper, and others cypress. Try some different things and see what works for you.
    One important thing that doesnt appear to have been mentioned yet is that with any of the "loose substrates" you will need to feed your snake in a separate tub. Loose substrates can very easily be picked up and ingested causing infections and possible impaction.

    The plants... yeah it will crush them. Corns are very active snakes and as they get bigger they will crush and up root any live plants that are in the cage.
     
  14. caliking

    caliking New Member

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    wood chips are best. They are easy cleanble, cheap and the corn will be able to burrow under it
     
  15. Libby

    Libby Embryo

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    Hello all! Was thinking of getting a corn snake for my classroom (have a post about it in snake room) and was wondering if "Carefresh" bedding (basically recycled, shredded paper that has been sterilized) could be used as a substrate? I already use that for my rat class pet, and would be nice to store just one type of bedding (also wood chips tend to give me hives..yuck!).
     
  16. Axe

    Axe Well-Known Member

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    I don't know of anybody having problems with carefresh, many actually really like it, although I've not used it myself yet.
     
  17. Spoony

    Spoony Embryo

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    That is great that you want to bring a snake into a classroom setting!

    I've heard these same two things from a couple of sources..
    >It has been known to sometimes cause to respiritory infection.
    >It is also known to dry out the snakes enclosures.

    What kind of wood chips gave you hives? If you aren't sure, try using Aspen shavings. Before putting them in with the snake though, buy a bag and expose yourself to them and try to give yourself hives. If you get hives, throw them out and try something else for a substrate. Doing this before you get the snake will be less stressfull for both of you. The snake won't be being moved around into different strange enclosures everyday, and you won't be stressing over the snake stressing and the hives.

    The Special Needs of Classroom reptiles

    That's a good article on classroom reptiles. In your other post it sounded like you had most of the stuff thought through, but this has a couple other things to consider too.

    And make sure those kids wash their hands!! Before and after handling. That'll help prevent anything that could be harmful to either the snake or the kids being transmitted.

    Good luck!
     
  18. Libby

    Libby Embryo

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    Cool, thanks for the quick replies!

    I got hives from pine, cedar, and aspen shavings. Cypress bark is what I got for my snake and hopefully will work well (it's not as dusty as other shavings, so will be less exposure for me). My classroom has its own sink, so I'll make sure we have antibacterial softsoap at hand with paper towels closeby. I'll have a sign up by the "critter area" (rat, snake, hermit crab) that says something like this:

    1. Get permission 2. Wash hands 3. Gently get critter (that only after that students proves he/she can) 4. When finished, gently place back in enclosure and make sure it is secured 5. Wash hands.

    I have a poster too above the sink on proper hand washing, and will be discussed often (being a science class).

    Thanks for your replies, guys and gals, it's really helped me out! I'll post a pic of the enclosure once Checkers (my snake, yay) has a few days to get used to it. I really would like some constructive critisicm then, me being a new reptile owner and all, and I do want the best (yet economical) habitat for my new friend.
     

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